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eimaj-CVTV(6) R4:eimaj v kamus [189:01] also Chesser v GW LC 
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Post eimaj-CVTV(6) R4:eimaj v kamus [189:01] also Chesser v GW LC
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Liked By: kamus, flushrivet, gentlewhisper, thechesser


Sun Feb 12, 2012 3:11 pm
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Post Re: eimaj - CVTV(6) R4: eimaj v kamus [189:01]
[NOTE: Viewers should be aware that eimaj also live comments the Chesser-Gentlewhisper game on this video. That analysis begins at 97:20]

Thanks for the game(s) and the in-depth analysis which I quite enjoyed- you contemplated a couple of good plans that you ended up rejecting during the game. I can't believe I watched the whole thing! :) BTW, I believe the White opening Wuzhe played is known as the Colle-Zukertort which is a popular line with club players though White generally plays Bd3 rather than e2.

In our game, as far as 3...a4 goes, I remembered Tony Miles' analysis from his game in this line with Karpov (who rejected 3.a4 and later went on to lose(!) for other reasons) that he was unafraid of it and was contemplating 3...b4!? with an odd but possibly playable position as well as 3...Bb7. As he says: :Chandler-Basman, London 1979, which went 3 a4(?!) Bb7 4 axb5 axb5!? (simple and good is 4...Bxe4 5 bxa6 Bb7 or even 5...Nxa6) 5 Rxa8 Bxa8 6 Nd2 e6!? 7 Bxb5 f5 8 Qe2 (8 Qh5+ g6 9 Qe2 seems preferable) 8...Nf6 9 Bd3 c5 10 Ngf3 c4! 11 Bxc4 fxe4 12 Ne5 Bd6 with good compensation for the pawn."- Miles. Actually 3.a4 nowadays is a standard reply: 1.e4 a6!? 2. d4 b5!? 3. a4 Bb7 4. ab ab 5.Rxa8 Bxa8 Nd2 is given in the "books" and white has an edge. I would have probably played b4 which also appears to give an edge to White if not exactly a winning advantage.

As for 9...Nxe4 or Nxd5, I did look at those lines but concluded that the trick didn't work, an assessment that the engine seems to confirm-it just seems to lose a piece in that position and in later positions too. My move, 9...Nbd7 was considered best by the computer though it thinks (correctly, I believe) that White is a little better. 10. b4, which you questioned, I think was just fine though the engine incrementally prefers 10.Be3. BTW, I believe the term you were looking for was "desperado".

I think I was worse until 13...0-0 when the position seems roughly equal. My 16...f5 may have been a bit rash due to 17.exf5! and Black will have to work a bit to recover the pawn though it seems he will get it back eventually.

19.Nc5!?, which I overlooked, looks pretty good, optically speaking, but the engine seems to think Black is just fine. Chess is full of surprises!

It seems that 20.Nxa6?! would not have been very good for White due to 20...e4! 21.Qe2 Ng4! and the engine feels that White has issues on f2. I sort of looked at something like that during the game and concluded Black would probably still be OK but the computer says Black would actually be better which I didn't think so at the time. You played 20.Re1 when the engine thinks that Nh5! fully equalizes for Black though it also likes the move I played, 20...a5 when it's about level.

Obviously, 23. Qxe4 would have been an improvement after which the engine says the position is dead level- after 23.Rxe4? Bf5 Black is apparently winning- at the time I wasn't so sure- I thought Black was better but it still looked like a lot of work lay ahead.

Also, I didn't think you were disrespectful in the least- you would have been justified in playing on looking for stalemate etc. I feel all players are entitled to play on, regardless. Having done a lot of endgame studies, I am aware that the most unexpected resources lurk in the most lost-looking positions.

At any rate, I thank you for the game and the time you took to look at this. Good luck in the balance of the tournament! :)

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Mon Feb 13, 2012 10:01 am
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Post Re: eimaj-CVTV(6) R4:eimaj v kamus [189:01] also Chesser v G
Wait..what..How cool is that ! Have to check that out !

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Mon Feb 13, 2012 10:14 am
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Post Re: eimaj - CVTV(6) R4: eimaj v kamus [189:01]
kamus wrote:
[NOTE: Viewers should be aware that eimaj also live comments the Chesser-Gentlewhisper game on this video. That analysis begins at 97:20]
Thanks for highlighting this - when I noticed that their game was starting I couldn't resist =)

Thanks for the game(s) and the in-depth analysis which I quite enjoyed- you contemplated a couple of good plans that you ended up rejecting during the game. I can't believe I watched the whole thing! :)
BTW, I believe the White opening Wuzhe played is known as the Colle-Zukertort which is a popular line with club players though White generally plays Bd3 rather than e2.

=========================================

Diagram 1: After 2...b5 (from the game):
Image
In our game, as far as 3...a4 goes, I remembered Tony Miles' analysis from his game in this line with Karpov (who rejected 3.a4 and later went on to lose(!) for other reasons) that he was unafraid of it and was contemplating 3...b4!? with an odd but possibly playable position as well as 3...Bb7. As he says: Chandler-Basman, London 1979, which went 3 a4(?!) Bb7 4 axb5 axb5!? (simple and good is 4...Bxe4 5 bxa6 Bb7 or even 5...Nxa6) 5 Rxa8 Bxa8 6 Nd2 e6!? 7 Bxb5 f5 8 Qe2 (8 Qh5+ g6 9 Qe2 seems preferable) 8...Nf6 9 Bd3 c5 10 Ngf3 c4! 11 Bxc4 fxe4 12 Ne5 Bd6 with good compensation for the pawn."- Miles.

Hidden Text Below - [Show it] - [Hide it Again]


I am amazed that I didn't recognise the opening - I am very much aware of the Karpov-Miles game.
You mentioned Basman in our chat after the game. A friend (thanks Andy!) has pointed out this excellent Andrew Martin video on Mike Basman


===================================

Actually 3.a4 nowadays is a standard reply: 1.e4 a6!? 2. d4 b5!? 3. a4 Bb7 4. ab ab 5.Rxa8 Bxa8 Nd2 is given in the "books" and white has an edge. I would have probably played b4 which also appears to give an edge to White if not exactly a winning advantage.

Diagram 2: After 6.Nd2 (from analysis):
Image

======================================

Diagram 3: After 5.Bxc4 (from the game):
Image
If, instead of 5...e5 Black played 5...e6, an interesting line is 6.Qb3 exd5!? 7.Qxb7 Nc6!

Diagram 4: After 7...Nc6! (from analysis):
Image
8.Bxd5 Bb4+ 9.Bd2 Ra7

Diagram 5: After 9...Ra7 (from analysis):
Image
The queen is trapped. However White seems okay in a complicated position after 10.Bxc6 Rxb7 11.Bxb7

Diagram 6: After 11.Bxb7 (from analysis):

Image

==========================================

As for 9...Nxe4 or Nxd5, I did look at those lines but concluded that the trick didn't work, an assessment that the engine seems to confirm-it just seems to lose a piece in that position and in later positions too. My move, 9...Nbd7 was considered best by the computer though it thinks (correctly, I believe) that White is a little better. 10. b4, which you questioned, I think was just fine though the engine incrementally prefers 10.Be3. BTW, I believe the term you were looking for was "desperado".
Thanks yes, that's the one!

Diagram 7: After 11.Bh4 (from the game):
Image
Here, the trick 'sort of' does work: 11...Nxe4 12.Bxe7 Nxc3 13.Bxd8 Nxd1 14.Bxc7

Diagram 8: After 14.Bxc7 (from analysis):
Image
14...Nb2 15.Bb3 Ke7 16.Rab1 Nd3 17.Rbd1 Rhc8 18.Rxd3 Rxc7

Diagram 9: After 18...Rxc7 (from analysis):
Image
and Black is doing fine


=========================================

I think I was worse until 13...0-0 when the position seems roughly equal. My 16...f5 may have been a bit rash due to 17.exf5! and Black will have to work a bit to recover the pawn though it seems he will get it back eventually.

19.Nc5!?, which I overlooked, looks pretty good, optically speaking, but the engine seems to think Black is just fine. Chess is full of surprises!

It sure is! When I saw and played 19.Nc5 I thought I was probably winning, but after your reply 19...Bc8 I was flummoxed

Diagram 10: After 19...Bc8 (from the game):
Image


It seems that 20.Nxa6?! would not have been very good for White due to 20...e4! 21.Qe2 Ng4! and the engine feels that White has issues on f2. I sort of looked at something like that during the game and concluded Black would probably still be OK but the computer says Black would actually be better which I didn't think so at the time. You played 20.Re1 when the engine thinks that Nh5! fully equalizes for Black though it also likes the move I played, 20...a5 when it's about level.

Diagram 11: After 20...e4! (from analysis):
Image
After 21.Qe2, ...Qe5 is also a strong alternative to ...Ng4. It seems Black is okay, at least.


Obviously, 23. Qxe4 would have been an improvement after which the engine says the position is dead level- after 23.Rxe4? Bf5 Black is apparently winning- at the time I wasn't so sure- I thought Black was better but it still looked like a lot of work lay ahead.

Also, I didn't think you were disrespectful in the least- you would have been justified in playing on looking for stalemate etc. I feel all players are entitled to play on, regardless. Having done a lot of endgame studies, I am aware that the most unexpected resources lurk in the most lost-looking positions.
I agree whole-heartedly =)

At any rate, I thank you for the game and the time you took to look at this. Good luck in the balance of the tournament! :)


Thanks kamus - gl to you also =)


Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:15 pm
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Post Re: eimaj-CVTV(6) R4:eimaj v kamus [189:01] also Chesser v G
Oh, and another thing =)

Diagram 12: After 5...e5 (from the game):
Image
During your commentary kamus, you mentioned after 5...e5 the possibility of White playing 6.Qb3 - threatening on b7 as well as on f7 via the d6 pawn push. I reckon if I'd have seen it I'd have played it, though perhaps it's not quite as good as it looks (apparently a theme to this game):

Diagram 13: After 6.Qb3 Qc8 (from analysis):
Image
7.d6 Nf6 (7...Bxd6 8.Bxf7+ Kf8 9.Bxg8 Rxg8 10.Nf3 looks bad for Black) 8.Bxf7+ Kd8 9.dxc7+ Qxc7

Diagram 14: After 9...Qxc7 (from analysis):
Image
White is up a pawn and Black's king looks vulnerable, but it's a complicated position. My computer insists, after 10.Be3 (threatening Bb6 pinning and winning Black's queen) Nc6 (introducing the defensive resource 11.Bb6 Bb4+) 11.Nf3, that Black is hanging on in there, evaluating the position as ±

Diagram 15: After 11.Nf3 (from analysis):
Image
Difficult to believe that this isn't as good as it looks!

==========================================

There was an alternative for Black:
Diagram 16: After 6.Qb3 Bc8 (from analysis):
Image
Now, after 7.d6 Bxd6 8.Bxf7+ Kf8

Diagram 17: After 8...Kf8 (from analysis):
Image
My computer evaluates this position as plus-over-equals.
It looks better for Black than the 6...Qc8 line, level on material and with perhaps a less-vulnerable king, so I guess this would've been the best continuation.


Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:06 am
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Post Re: eimaj-CVTV(6) R4:eimaj v kamus [189:01] also Chesser v G
Very interesting- it's amazing how complicated and weird Chess can get after just 5 moves. :shock: My friend, NM Brian Wall, plays 1.e4 a6 2. d4 b6!? which he says was a suggestion from his pal, IM John Watson. He played this move in all his Black games in a recent tournament and won all of them (and the tournament). I may try that next time out because although I've had surprisingly good success with the St. George -indeed, I played it exclusively for one year and it ended up being the most successful opening, by far, that I played that entire year, white or black- I always feel like I'm flying by the seat of my pants and just barely hanging on!

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Tue Feb 14, 2012 11:00 am
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