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Two Scandinavians, interesting N vs. B endgames 
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Post Two Scandinavians, interesting N vs. B endgames
My game from yesterday in the Dutch Open:

My game from today in the Dutch Open:


Last edited by Phobetor on Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Sat Jul 28, 2007 1:13 pm
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N.N. - Me

10... Bg4 is one option, but 10... Nbd7 seems to be better. Then after 11. d5 cxd5 12. Bxd5 Qxb2 seems to be ok, since the bishop is still on the b1-h7 diagonal (threatening Bd3) and the knight is already developed to d7, preventing Bxb7 from trapping the rook. 11. O-O-O is another option then, but after 11... Nb6 12. Bb3 Bg4! 13. d5! Bxf3 14. gxf3 cxd5 14. Qb5+ Kd8! black seems to bve able to survive the pressure and equalize or better.

11. d5 is possible, 11. O-O-O is another option. 11. O-O-O prevents Qxb2 lines (11. d5 Bxf3 12. gxf3 cxd5 13. Bxd5 Qxb2!?), but often it just transposes.

13... Nc6?! is given in my Scandi-book as not-so-good, because 14. Bxc6+ bxc6 15. Qe4 Rc8 16. O-O-O gives white a good position. It's quite similar to the actual game, but with 14. Bxc6 white makes sure black recaptures with his b-pawn, and dthe bishop on d5 isn't hanging anymore (after 15... Qg5 in the game). Also notice that 14. Bxc6 bxc6 15. Qa6? doesn't win a pawn because of 15... Qxf3!

White could have played 15. O-O-O, but then the king can be "checked", so black can simply play 15... Be7, meeting 16. Bc3 with Qh6+.

15... Qg5 looks very nice :) It prevents white from castling either side, and it also attacks Bd5 forcing it to make a choice.

White could have played 18. Qxg6 hxg6 19. Bxg7 but after 19... Rxh4 black has the better endgame.

On move 18 I actually planned 18... Bf6, simply trading off the bishops instead of giving him a decent pawn structure again, but then white can play 19. Bxe6! when 19... Qxe4 20. Bd7+ Ke7 21. fxe4 is good for white, and 19... fxe6 20. Qxe6+ Ne7 (Rc8 is hanging) 21. Rhe1 also looks very dangerous.

21. Bd4 looks interesting, when 21... Nxd4? 22. Rxd4, 23. Ba4+ and 24. Rd7 gives white a rook on the 7th rank.

21. f5 also looks interesting, when 21... Bxc3? 22. fxe6! is better for white, so black has to play 21... Ke7 22. fxe6 fxe6 23. Bxb4+ Nxb4. It's hard to say who's better in that endgame; the bishop covers e6 and potentially d7, but the black knight would also vbe very strong on e5.

26. Bxc6 seems to be better than 26. Rxd8, because the knight eventually proves to be stronger than the bishop. It's hard to say if the endgame is won, drawn or lost for black, but I think black has good chances.

On move 43 I could also have played 43... h5 44. Ke3 g5, but after 45. Bd1 gxh4 46. Bxh5 Nxe4 I'm not sure black can win anymore. The game then opens up, which favours white's bishop.

55. Bxf5? is lost of course, since the g-pawn is protected. Black just collects the c-pawn, and if white moves his king to g6, then g4 Kxh6 g3 Kg7 g2 h6 g1Q+ and black wins as well.

56. Ke3 also doesn't save white's cause, since after 56... Nd5+ 57. Kd3 58. Nf4+ white's h-pawn drops, and if 57. Kd2 then simply 57... Kf4 should be 0-1. 56. c4 also looks bad, since black can just play 56... Kd6, 57... Kc5 and 58... Kxc4 or 58... Kb4.

If 65. Kh3 then 65... Kd3 66. Kg3 Ke3 also wins. If 67. Bd1 then 67... Nf4+ 68. Kg2 (else Nf2+) Kf4 with 69... g4, 70... Kg5 and 71... Kxh5.


Last edited by Phobetor on Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.



Sat Jul 28, 2007 1:46 pm
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Phobetor, this is really cool. I was wondering if there's a website or anything that gives an overview of the tournament.

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Sun Jul 29, 2007 8:33 am
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http://www.schaakbond.nl/nieuws/dieren2007/index-e.htm is the english website, but that doesn't have a link to the games, just the live games. So if you want to view games, go to http://www.schaakbond.nl/nieuws/dieren2 ... heatre.htm

For standings/pairings just click the group (I'm in the Open Group) and click Results/Standings/Pairings :wink:


Sun Jul 29, 2007 8:38 am
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Cool, how did you get selected to play? Was it invitation? Sorry if this is answered on the website, I'm about to go read it...

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Sun Jul 29, 2007 8:39 am
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The Open Group is for everyone FIDE-rated 2100+ (and some promising youth players rated 2000-2100). I'm 2143 so I can just register :)


Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:36 am
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Before I analyze the second game, maybe you or anyone else would like to take a look at the endgame that arises after 61. exf6. I analyzed it and found a clear win for black, but it's certainly not so easy.

Another point I would like to make (which can be argued) is that I don't think it's a coincidence that I have had three B vs. N endgames so far in the tournament, and that all three times the knight is stronger than the bishop. The two games above are where I had the knight and won, and the 136 moves game I posted elsewhere is where I had the bishop and just got away with a draw...


Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:40 am
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The position after 61.exf6 is pretty interesting:

Image

I'll analyze it tomorrow and see if I can find the win! Black's position looks great but there is so little material that winning will be difficult.

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Mon Jul 30, 2007 9:11 pm
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It's a good endgame exercise. There is indeed a win for black, and again it involves "tempoplay" (just like my 136 moves game against the IM)

By the way, today I got another Scandinavian victory, and so far this tournament my score with the Scandinavian is 3/3 :D (so to anyone who thinks it's "unplayable"; I scored 3/3 and my opponents were 2084, 2194 and 2247 :))


Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:26 pm
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Great results with the scandinavian! Also could you post a hint to this ending, I can't seem to find a breakthrough. White keeps getting the opposition. I've been trying to find a triangulation trick, but I can't make it work.

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Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:46 pm
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After exf6 there are two possible endgame-situations left for black: black's king is on e5, white's is on e3, and the two possibilities are a pawn on e6 and a pawn on e4. As you can see, after exf6 Kxf6 Kd3! Ke5 Ke3! black would like to be able to waste a tempo, but unfortunately knights can't lose tempos :)

So maybe you should try pushing the pawn first, and then putting your king on e5...


Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:26 pm
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Ah, I found that trick for white. I'll have to look at the pawn push lines. Also, it sounds like you're tearing it up in the tournament. Congrats!

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Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:57 pm
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hi all,


Image

This regards the endgame after 61) ef6 Kf6 (above). I disagree with Phobetor and Josh's ideas on this postion. General appearances would suggest that black is dominating and white is lost. White's bishop is horrible- it can't even move in the starting postion- and black has an extra passed pawn! In fact white is busted here but I disagree with Phobetor's "tempoplay" ideas and Josh's attempts at triangulation.

Black just needs to ask "what is the ideal placement for my pieces?" and find a way to get them there. It turns out it's not so hard and white is powerless to stop black. So here it is...

61) ef6 Kf6 62) Kd3...

since white's bishop is effectively stalemated this is the only move and doesn't get an (!). White needs to be able to play Ke3 when blacks king lands on e5 to prevent black from infiltrating via square f4.

62) ...Ke5 63) Ke3

Image

Phobetor says that "black would like to be able to waste a tempo" but this misses the whole winning idea. Black just needs to get the knight to f6 where it guards d5 and e4 and attacks the g4 pawn (eliminating this pawn is the key). Then black can move the king and start advancing his passed pawn.

An interesting point about the above diagram is that if you take the bishop and knight off the board black would be a pawn up with a passed pawn but would not be able to make progress (since it's black's move).

63)...Nc6 64) Bc2

Now white's king can't move but the bishop can. It doesn't matter where the bishop goes but this square allows a little annoyance if black plays inaccurately.

64)...Nb8

if black plays Ne7 with the idea of Ng8 > f6 then white could respond Bh7. Black would then just go back to c6 and proceed as with the text.

65) Be4 (or anywhere else) ...Nd7 66) Bf3 Nf6 67) Be2 Kd6 68) Bf3 e5 69) Kd3

if white plays 69) Be2 black of course continues with e4 and if 69) Kd2 then 69)...e4 followed by Ke5 and manuevering the knight to f4 with dominating efect.

69)... e4+

Image

The key: black trades the passed e-pawn for the pawn on g4 and gets an outside passed pawn. White will no longer control the f5/h5 squares so black will be able to advance this pawn with the help of the king and knight. The win is pretty simple from here. White cannot stop the pawn while at the same time prevent the black king or knight from going to the queenside to gobble the other pawns (I tried to come up with some way white could sac the bishop for the passed g-pawn and then run with the king to pick off the last two black pawns but to no avail).

Instead of playing e4 on the 69th turn black could put the king on e6 first and we would then have 69)...Ke6 70) Ke3 e4 71) Be4 Ng4+.

This winning idea may not be so easy to find over the board from the starting position but since black is in no danger of losing they can just take their time.

congrats to Phobetor on what sounds like a successful tournament.

-Jonathan

Thanks to Josh for pointing out my omission of the move Nf6 earlier. Hope it didn't confuse too many of you. :wink: Note that when I forgot the move Nf6 blacks king was on e6 when the move 69)...e4+ came. Here the black king is on d6 but black should still win without too much trouble.


Last edited by jonathan kenny on Fri Aug 03, 2007 5:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.



Thu Aug 02, 2007 5:50 pm
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Jonathan,

Thanks for the analysis, it definitely looks like the winning idea! I like how black gives up the e-pawn to win the crucial outside passer. However, I think there might be one tiny mistake in the variation you gave. I don't see the move where black plays Nf6 (unless I'm just blind). That being said, I think you've described the clearly winning plan, so we can just insert the move Nf6 anywhere after Nd7.

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Thu Aug 02, 2007 8:26 pm
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oops! :oops:

thanks for noticing that, Josh. I accidentally skipped Nf6 which should come on move 66 for black followed by Kd6 > e5 > Ke6 (or e4) > e4. I'll go back and edit the post.

-J


Fri Aug 03, 2007 5:28 pm
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