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curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24] 
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Post curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
Poster: curtains
Name: International Master Gregory Shahade
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Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:43 pm
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
long time watcher first time commenter- thanks for all the hours of entertainment and education- your effort and big geniusness and sense of humor are deeply appreciated!

i totally understand what you're saying- i dont condone hurting people especially kids but yeah we need to have compassion and understanding for these "bad people" who really are suffering and sick themselves and do need help- i am a recovering heroin addict and did not get better through judgement and moralizing from myself or anyone else

keep up the great chess work and all your interesting and hilarious asides it is a positive contribution to humanity which if everyone emulated in whatever way worked for them would make the world a better place- sounds corny but its true stuff like this enriches life, not to overstate it i mean youre probably just as much an asshole or idiot as anyone else but youre putting yourself out there which is commendable. thanks and take care!


Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:10 pm
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
omg you called me an asshole and an idiot in one post :)

Happy you enjoy, follow up video coming next.


Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:13 pm
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Pawn

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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
oh yeah not to break anyone's confidentiality or anonymity or whatever but i happened to go to rehab with this guy who said he was friends with you from the NY area- lets say his name rhymes with XXX XXXX- it was funny the day i got there i happened to ask this guy showing me around if anyone there played chess and he turned out to be a master. he usually won but i did alright, winning at least one game and giving him a run for his money. it seems daunting for weakies to play masters but it was a good lesson in the fact that we all play with the same pieces and are just human beings after all.

anyway you seem like a nice and smart guy but you know what i mean, its not so much that youre some spectacular person that i respect so much as what you do with that- theres plenty of even more talented people out there who offer little to nothing to the world, and even total imbeciles who at least try and do something positive in whatever small way they can. in the bigger scheme the USCL and chess videos and interesting discussions may be totally irrelevant, but they mean a lot to people like me who follow this stuff. so play on playa!

(EDITED BY MODERATOR SINCE IMO REHAB ANONYMITY IS SACRED!!!!)


Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:39 pm
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
lol at pedophile sympathy speech at beginning.

Actually agree with a lot of what you said. You can't judge people based solely on slip-ups like this. Of course, the reason there are laws against this is that children have been hurt by sex predators, many, many times. However, I don't think that they are really catching the same social group of people who they had in mind in the first place when creating this TV show. Sure, they may catch some really, seriously bad people, but also may be catching men who's minds are slipping, with no real intention to do harm, just falling for the allure of the chat room. All the prosecutors look for is some evidence of intent (chat dialog transcripts, and then actually showing up at the house, with condoms), and the knowledge in the defendant that the girl was under 18. Really, there is no way of really knowing what was going on in this persons mind, what they really would have done: gone through with it, sat down with the minor and had a heart to heart, or just run away.


Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:43 pm
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
It's true but I strongly suspect that in close to 100% of those cases they would have gone through with it :/


Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:56 pm
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
vivmura wrote:
anyway you seem like a nice and smart guy but you know what i mean, its not so much that youre some spectacular person that i respect so much as what you do with that- theres plenty of even more talented people out there who offer little to nothing to the world, and even total imbeciles who at least try and do something positive in whatever small way they can. in the bigger scheme the USCL and chess videos and interesting discussions may be totally irrelevant, but they mean a lot to people like me who follow this stuff. so play on playa!

(EDITED BY MODERATOR SINCE IMO REHAB ANONYMITY IS SACRED!!!!)



Are you insane, ofc I'm huge spectacular person!!!!!!!!!!1


Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:57 pm
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
yeah good thing you edited that rehab anonymity IS sacred and i will probably die a painful lonely death by drug overdose as a result of even broaching the subject- i get carried away trying to be open about my situation forgetting others right to be closted ex-crackheads if they want to be

and obv you are huge spectacular person what was i thinking?! ( :roll:


Wed Jul 22, 2009 11:07 pm
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
Wow- that was an extremely provocative commentary on Internet predators. I don't agree that these guys could be good people at heart that just have "one small thing" ruining them. Most of them are losers in every sense of the word. You don't see scientists or firemen on that show- they're usually sad married guys living some f----ed up double life on the internet or lonely geeks who couldn't get laid in a women's prison with a fistful of pardons from the governor.

One famous exception from the chess world is GM Alex Sherzer, a doctor who seemed like a handsome intelligent guy who could get women his own age. Makes it all the more puzzling what the hell he was thinking. Like you said, the mind can deceive itself- "Some part of Dr. Alex Sherzer knew what was coming, he said, and he did it anyway." http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/988449/posts

That's a real psychological sickness. You're right that society should have better ways of treating these people, but there's such a social stigma attached to being attracted to minors it's almost impossible that any of them would seek professional help. As for the historical precedents- it was also acceptable in some societies to beat women, or to rape, pillage and enslave people who didn't look like you, some cultures even allowed cannibalism. Regardless of what a person may have the urge to do, the cost of living in a society of other human beings is adapting to the norms and mores of that particular culture. These people are sociopaths who can't- or won't- respect the laws of their society.


Thu Jul 23, 2009 12:00 am
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
That show sounds disgusting, I bet 99% of the people are just watching it because of the sensationalism.


Thu Jul 23, 2009 12:49 am
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
I agree with Hitchhiker, that show sounds disgusting indeed. Even just listening to the description made me want to fast-forward the video.

Being attracted to a "minor" is one thing. The age of consent is an arbitrary (but necessary) "bright line" cut off because physical maturity levels vary widely and some "minors" look much older than they are. But taking steps to act on that intent is where criminal liability starts. Mens Rea vs. Actus Reus.

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Thu Jul 23, 2009 1:41 am
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
I love watching the show, however I have not one thread of sympathy for these people who show up at Chris Hansen's house. It is one thing being addicted to something such as drugs/alcohol or gambling that will harm you, it is quite another to show up at some kids house with grand illusions of having sex with a child, you have to believe if they have showed up here, how many actual kids have they met? Doing something like this will scar a child for the rest of their life, which is why I think child molesters should get mandatory life imprisonments, castrations, or the death penalty. There are just too many repeat offenders to say that even those who get help for their problem can function in society. These sickos will get a few months or years in jail/prison while the kids they hurt will carry this burden with them for the rest of their life. These are kids we're talking about, not grown adults. There is a reason that even in prison these people are frowned upon, convicts even want to kill them.

The local police in my community did one of these To Catch A Predator-type stings about a year ago resulting in over 150 arrests in just 2 days. I live between Ann Arbor and Detroit Michigan, and they had people come from as far as four hours away. People in the community were outraged when they read about it in the paper, saying it made our small town less safer, huh. If anything, these people will not come back, making the kids here that much safer.

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Thu Jul 23, 2009 7:10 am
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
That group Hansen works with- Perverted Justice is a pretty questionable bunch. Check out the criticism section on the wiki page on them:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perverted-Justice

I have no sympathy for child predators being a dad of two young daughters myself but these people are hardly better. They sent a swat team (with a camera team, naturally) to some guy's house who had contacted a decoyonline but decided against showing up. When he heard them breaking in to his house, he shot himself- that's hardly justice.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/showtra ... es-la.html

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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
Yeah I initially found the show fascinating like curtains, but quickly grew disgusted with the whole thing. I agree that Hansen and his crew are doing at least as much harm as good, I mean of course in theory it seems right to do what you can to stop child predators, but the whole scheme involving entrapment and public humiliation and all is questionable at best. And as for the guys themselves, and for that matter murderers or other criminals, it's not a matter of absolving them of responsibility or seeing them as innocent victims of circumstances beyond their control to be put in the same boat as addicts or whatever- clearly they are making bad decisions which cause others suffering- but I just feel it's important to understand the reasons behind their behavior and realize that no sane happy person wakes up one day and decides to hurt people. These people are troubled by their own suffering (likely history of abuse, etc.) and probably have some kind of sickness which warrants treatment rather than punishment. Then you get into problems of what constitues say addiction as a disease but pedophilia as a sick choice, genetics/brain chemistry, free will and the like, which gets difficult to say the least. It's very easy to righteously condemn others are out there who are "bad" but much more difficult and valuable to look inside yourself and have some compassion for the perpetrators as well as the victims- we are all just human beings with complex histories and biological predispositions who are capable of both acting cruelly and of changing and doing good. Then there's the issue of what age is old enough- I mean clearly there's some difference between being attracted to a 6 year old and a 16 year old, and while just having a desire is one thing, acting on the latter seems much more understandable, and yet any lines you draw will of course be arbitrary...whatever, I'm just saying none of us are perfect and judging will not help in the long run as much as empathy and trying to treat the underlying issues which lead to such deviant behavior. Whew. Chess is fun!


Thu Jul 23, 2009 12:29 pm
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Post Re: curtains - L411: B vs IandMyself [IM] [29:24]
Hard Candy.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0424136/
A mature 14-year old girl meets a charming 32-year old photographer on the Internet. Suspecting that he is a pedophile, she goes to his home in an attempt to expose him.


Fri Jul 24, 2009 3:17 am
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