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Homemade studies [IV] Umweg 
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Knight
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Post Homemade studies [IV] Umweg
Chess board: 7q/b1p5/1p1Npkb1/pPP2ppP/P1P5/3B2P1/5P1R/K3R3 w - - 0 1
7q/b1p5/1p1Npkb1/pPP2ppP/P1P5/3B2P1/5P1R/K3R3 w - - 0 1
White to move and win
Published in Euxinus Pontus no.13 (July-September 2010) as number E4.

Enjoy!

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Fri Oct 29, 2010 12:57 am
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Knight
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Post Re: Homemade studies [IV] Umweg
Well, it seems that the study is either too difficult, or too boring, or both :)
So, I'll give (half of) the solution, hopefully transforming the position into something more manageable (or at least more interesting to look at):

Hidden Text Below - [Show it] - [Hide it Again]



How does the solution continue?

Enjoy :!:

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Tue Jul 19, 2011 6:10 am
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Pawn

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Post Re: Homemade studies [IV] Umweg
The moves you have given are easy for me, which I did without your hint. After caging the Bishop & Queen, how to proceed? It is the hardest part. How can we force Black King to vacate black squares to promote f pawn, especially as we can not move knight or bishop allowing Black Queen to escape?
It was torture for me taking up the whole holiday. As you might have guessed, chess engines are of no help (by the way, I thought Houdini engine was quite invincible, i.e., up till now).
Ultimately I found the theme. Walk the king upto d8! Then for Black it is either lose c7 pawn or let White f pawn to promote. But I was not sure. Can White still win after Black Queen comes out? I believed so, but confirmed it will Houdini. Even after, I had to confirm by checking Rybka Forums and your posts there.
Imagine the number players tortured by this puzzle (with so many hits and no posts).
I congratulate you for bringing up such masterpiece which could rubbish Rybka & Houdini.
Please give the key in hidden form to avoid frustration for most players.


Mon Nov 07, 2011 9:39 am
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Pawn

Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2011 7:59 am
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Post Re: Homemade studies [IV] Umweg
Thanks for introducing me to the fascinating field of chess engine limitations...happened to read your posts rybka forums and it will take some time to absorb all that information.


Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:59 am
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Knight
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Post Re: Homemade studies [IV] Umweg
snrao wrote:
The moves you have given are easy for me, which I did without your hint. After caging the Bishop & Queen, how to proceed? It is the hardest part. How can we force Black King to vacate black squares to promote f pawn, especially as we can not move knight or bishop allowing Black Queen to escape?
It was torture for me taking up the whole holiday. As you might have guessed, chess engines are of no help (by the way, I thought Houdini engine was quite invincible, i.e., up till now).
Ultimately I found the theme. Walk the king upto d8! Then for Black it is either lose c7 pawn or let White f pawn to promote. But I was not sure. Can White still win after Black Queen comes out? I believed so, but confirmed it will Houdini. Even after, I had to confirm by checking Rybka Forums and your posts there.
Imagine the number players tortured by this puzzle (with so many hits and no posts).
I congratulate you for bringing up such masterpiece which could rubbish Rybka & Houdini.
Please give the key in hidden form to avoid frustration for most players.


Thanks for the kind words.
I'm glad you like it (and also that you do not blindly follow engines from now on :D )

Hidden Text Below - [Show it] - [Hide it Again]


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2 plus 2 is 5 for large values of 2


Fri Nov 11, 2011 7:15 am
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Knight
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Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:54 am
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Location: Romania
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Post Re: Homemade studies [IV] Umweg
snrao wrote:
Thanks for introducing me to the fascinating field of chess engine limitations...happened to read your posts rybka forums and it will take some time to absorb all that information.


You're welcome :)
Today's engines have 4 huge gaps of "understanding":
- Fortress, be it around the enemy queen, king, or around the own king, where the humans use the concepts of "never" and "forever" to understand the position
- Long-term strategy, when humans see without calculating that a favourable position will eventually come on the board, even if they don't know how many moves it takes to get there.
- Zugzwang (self-explanatory)
- Cycles, when one move of progress is achieved after a cycle of N moves (extended zwischenzug)... Some have considered this to be the same as long term strategy, I think it has some particularities.

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2 plus 2 is 5 for large values of 2


Fri Nov 11, 2011 7:44 am
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